Talking Points: Abortion

*Background — Significance of Abortion Issue:

To learn about the significance of the abortion issue, click here.

* Q and A — The Talking Points on Abortion Include Answers to the following Questions.

  • What has Donld Trump said about the Dobbs decision and abortion?
  • Is Abortion Murder?
  • What does the Bible say about Abortion?
  • Was Abortion Legal when the US Constitution was Adopted?
  • When can a fetus feel pain?

*Talking Points:

Key Take Aways from Talking Points Paragraphs

  • Constitutional Right. Abortion was a constitutional right for almost 50 years and Donald Trump takes credit for the Supreme Court’s repeal of Roe vs. Wade.
  • Christian Beliefs about Personhood. Personhood — when does a fertilized egg become a person? Gary Wills, a Catholic historian, says that Saint Thomas Aquinas believed that a human soul was infused not at conception but sometime near childbirth, after going through earlier stages of receiving a nutritive (plant like) soul and then an animal soul.
  • Nidation. Catholic theologian Bernard Haring states that about half of the fertilized eggs fail to achieve nidation –adherence to the womb after fertilization. Nature or nature’s God would be the greatest killer if a fertilized ovum was a “baby”.
  • Bible. The Bible does not even mention abortion. In Exodus (21:22) there is even text that supports abortion rights. If a man strikes a women and she suffers a miscarriage but is not otherwise injured, he shall be fined. If the women is injured, then it is an eye for an eye type of punishment.
  • First Amendment Rights. Dobbs Deciosion violates first Amendment Rights of Muslims and Jews who do not believe that human life starts at conception.
  • Faulty Legal Basis. Dobbs decision faulty on legal grounds. It cherry picks and distorts history. It ignores the fundamental purpose of the 14th amendment that guaranteed a right of liberty from state control.
  • Abortion Legal in Colonial America. Abortion was legal when the Constitution was adopted.
  • Pregnant Women Endangered. Dobbs decision and the subsequent legal actions by some states is endangering the health of pregnant women.
  • Fetal Pain. Many medical researchers say there is clear evidence that a fetus cannot feel pain until after the 24th week. Some others say it is possible sooner.

Table of Contents of Talking Point Paragraphs

Abortion Was a Constitutional Right for Almost Fifty Years

Christian Beliefs on Personhood

–Bible and Abortion: What Does the Bible Say?

Dobbs Decision Violates First Amendment Rights of Muslims and Jews

Legal Critique: What Dobbs Got Wrong

Abortion: Legal When Constitution Adopted

Dobbs Decision Endangers Pregnant Women’s Health

When Can a Fetus Feel Pain?

–Abortion Was a Right for Almost Fifty Year.

A women’s control and rights over her own body (within reasonable limits) was part of the US Constitution for almost 50 years until the repeal of Roe vs. Wade in January 2022 by the US Supreme Court. To read the Dobbs vs. Jackson Health Organization decision of 2022, click here. To read a summary and excerpts from the Roe vs. Wade decision of 1973, click here.

Below is a video, provided by the DNC via Greenfly, of a former President’s view on the Dobbs decision.

-Christian Beliefs on Personhood

When Does a Fertilized Egg Become a Person? Much of the controversy about abortion revolves around the issue of personhood — when does life as a human person begin — i.e., when does a fertilized egg become a human person. Many Christians believe that it happens at conception. Gary Wills. a Catholic historian, argues that Catholic theologians such as Thomas Aquinas believed that a human soul was infused with the fetus sometime near childbirth, after going through earlier stages of being infused with a nutritive soul (plant like) and then an animal soul.

18 U.S.C. § 1111 defines murder as the unlawful killing of a human being with malice, and divides it into two degrees. Murder in the first degree is punishable by death. The view that abortion is murder depends on when the fertilized egg or fetus is believed to be a human being [or person].

It is estimated that about half of fertilized eggs fail to achieve “nidation” — adherence to the womb. So it would seem that nature itself or nature’s God might be the greatest killer, if the fertilized ovum was a “baby”.

Views on personhood are controversial. To read more about this topic as well as links to sources, including Gary Wills and alternative views, go to Deep Dive #1. To see views supportive of human life beginning at conception, click here.

-The Bible and Abortion.

There is no scriptural evidence for the belief that personhood starts at conception nor is there condemnation or even mention of abortion in the Bible. Indeed, in Exodus there is even text that supports abortion rights: “… When men have a fight and hurt a pregnant women, so that she suffers a miscarriage but no further injury, the guilty one shall be fined… but if injury ensues [to the women] you shall give life for life, eye for eye…” In other words, if the women is injured or killed, the penalty is an “eye for an eye”, but if just the fetus is harmed, and she has a miscarriage, only a fine is required.

-Dodds Decision Violates First Amendment Rights of Muslim and Jews.

Laws that enforce the view that personhood begins at conception are part of some Christain’s beliefs but violate the religious beliefs and first amendment rights of other USA citizens whose religions do not include that belief. The view that an individual human life begins at conception is not a view shared by all religions:

  • Muslims believe that Muhammed said that a soul enters a fetus about 120 days after conception.
  • The Talmud, used to interpret the Torah and other Jewish works, says a fetus is “mere water” for the first 40 days of gestation.
  • According to the Torah, God breathes life into a baby’s nostrils immediately after birth.
  • Jewish scripture holds that a mother’s life takes precedence over a fetus.

An article in the May June edition of Mother Jones explains how two Jewish women in Kentucky are suing for abortion rights. Click here to read the article.

–Cherry picking history. To cite one example, by citing the number of state laws banning abortion in 1868 (year of passage of the 14th amendment) but ignoring the fact the laws were rarely enforced.

–Ignoring the underlying fundamental purpose of the 14th amendment. The Fourteenth Amendment guaranteed a right of liberty against state control and includes the rights of individuals, not states, to decide whether and when to become pregnant and give birth to a child, and to create and raise a family.

To read the full text of a legal criticism of the Doobs decision, click here.

Abortion was legal during the Colonial period — when the US Constitution was formulated. Until about 1880, abortion was allowed and widely practiced in the United States. Click here to read more about the history of abortion.

-Dobbs Decision: Endangers Pregnant Womens’ Health.

According to a news item by MSNBC in November of 2022: “Following the Supreme Court’s decision to overturn the federal right to abortion, the practice is now banned in 13 states and restricted in Arizona, Florida and Georgia. More than a dozen studies, reports and editorials published in [November of 2022] in JAMA investigate the effects of that decision and highlight the many ways in which state-level changes are jeopardizing pregnant people’s health.” To read the news item, click here.

-Four women in Texas testified to their horrific experiences with the Texas abortion law during their pregnancies and brought suit against the State of Texas. Mary Ziegler, a reporter, writes that storytelling about these kinds of experiences is a powerful tool to change hearts and minds. She states that the campaign to expand abortion access post-Roe, “will have much to do with making clear what happens to real patients when abortion is a crime.”  To read about their case in the article in The Boston Globe, click here.

-When Can a Fetus Feel Pain?

In an article by Kristen Fischer and medically reviewed by Traci Johnson, MD on May 03, 2023 discusses the question — when can a fetus feel pain? Many in the medical community believe there’s clear evidence that a fetus – a developing baby in the womb – can’t feel physical pain until after the 24th week (6th month) of pregnancy. But other scientists say it’s possible for a fetus to feel pain as early as 12 weeks (3 months) into its development. To read the article, click here.

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